>> TRIBUTES HAVE BEEN POURING IN FOR THE LATE REVEREND JESSE JACKSON WHO DIED EARLY THIS WEEK AT THE AGE OF 84.

A LIFE DEDICATED TO FIGHTING FOR RACIAL JUSTICE, JACKSON'S PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGNS IN 1984 AND 1988 RESHAPED THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND PAVED THE WAY FOR BLACK POLITICIANS LIKE BARACK OBAMA.

AS JOURNALIST ALELIA BUNDLES EXPLAINS NOW TO MICHELLE MARTIN.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR TALKING WITH US.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> ONE OF THE REASONS I WAS GLAD TO SPEAK WITH YOU IS YOU ARE BOTH A JOURNALIST AND A BIOGRAPHER.

YOU HAVEN'T WRITTEN A BIOGRAPHY OF JESSE JACKSON, BUT OTHER NOTABLE FIGURES WHO HAD AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN AMERICAN PUBLIC LIFE.

SO I WANT TO START WITH YOUR COVERAGE OF THE JACKSON CAMPAIGN.

WHAT DO YOU REMEMBER FROM THAT CAMPAIGN?

>> SO I ACTUALLY COVERED THE 1984 CAMPAIGN.

SO I WAS ON THE TRAIL FROM JANUARY THROUGH THE CONVENTION IN SAN FRANCISCO.

IT WAS AN AMAZING RIDE.

IT WAS BOTH HISTORICAL --IT WAS SOMETIMES A LITTLE CHAOTIC, BUT WE REALLY DID SEE AN AMAZING CHANGE IN THE ELECTORATE.

>> WHEN PEOPLE SAY IT WAS SORT OF CHAOTIC AND WHY IS THAT?

IT WASN'T A CONVENTIONAL CAMPAIGN.

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, IT REALLY WAS AS MUCH A CRUSADE I THINK AS A CAMPAIGN, AND I REMEMBER HAVING --I WAS IN THE ATLANTA BUREAU FOR NBC AND IN 1983, REVEREND JACKSON HAD BEEN OUT ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO REGISTER TO VOTE.

I REMEMBER BEING IN MISSISSIPPI.

I DON'T REMEMBER WHICH TOWN, BUT IT WAS THE FIRST TIME I'D HEARD PEOPLE SAY, RUN, JESSE, RUN, AND HE WAS GETTING PEOPLE OUT TO VOTE.

HE WAS SAYING, YOU'VE GOT TO R EG REGSTER TO RIDE.

YOU'VE GOT TO GET ON BOARD TO RIDE, AND THAT WAS SORT OF THE BEGINNING.

YOU COULD SEE IT WAS A CRUSADE TO JUST RAISE PEOPLE'S CONSCIOUSNESS ABOUT THE POWER THEY COULD HAVE IF THEY VOTED.

THEN THE CAMPAIGN --EVEN BEFORE THE PRIMARIES, REVEREND JACKSON HAD GONE OVERSEAS AND HE HAD BEEN ABLE TO GET A PRISONER RELEASED, AND THAT WAS KIND OF -- HE WAS ALWAYS COOKING UP SOMETHING THAT GOT HEADLINES, BUT IT WAS, YOU KNOW, INSTINCT, BUT IT WAS ALSO STRATEGY TO GET ATTENTION SO THAT BY THE TIME THE PRIMARY STARTED, BY THE TIME NEW HAMPSHIRE WAS HAPPENING, BY THE TIME IOWA WAS HAPPENING, HE WAS ALREADY IN THE HEADLINES.

>> DID HE THINK THAT HE COULD ACTUALLY WIN?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU THINK --WHEN YOU READ ABOUT AS I HAVE BEEN DOING FOR THE LAST DAY, REMINDING MYSELF ABOUT HIS CHILDHOOD AND HOW CHARISMATIC HE WAS, AND REALLY HOW BIG AN EGO HE HAD, AND SELF-CONFIDENCE HE HAD EVEN FROM A YOUNG AGE, I THINK REVEREND JACKSON MIGHT HAVE BELIEVED THAT HE COULD WIN, YOU KNOW, AND THE REALITY IS THAT HE DID MUCH BETTER THAN MANY PEOPLE PREDICTED, THAT HE REALLY DID CONNECT WITH A WIDE RANGE OF PEOPLE.

HE, I THINK, HELPED TO BUILD THIS COALITION THAT WE SEE NOW THAT'S PART OF THE PROGRESSIVE WING OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, BUT HE WAS STIRRING UP THAT ENTHUSIASM IN A WAY THAT NO ONE HAD REALLY DONE BEFORE.

>> I WAS THERE IN THE '88 CAMPAIGN AND I REMEMBER THAT THERE WERE PEOPLE THERE THAT FRANKLY OTHER PEOPLE DID NOT EXPECT TO SEE AT A JESSE JACKSON EVENT.

TELL ME ABOUT THAT.

WHO WERE SOME OF THE PEOPLE WHO TURNED UP?

>> WELL, BECAUSE HE WOULD GO VISIT PEOPLE.

HE WOULD STAY IN PEOPLE'S HOMES SO FARMERS IN IOWA WERE THERE AT THE TOWN HALL MEETINGS IN NEW HAMPSHIRE THAT, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY A VERY WHITE STATE.

HE DREW PEOPLE --PEOPLE WHO WOULD NOT NORMALLY HAVE BEEN THERE, BUT HE HAD BEEN MAKING THESE RELATIONSHIPS WITH PEOPLE.

I WAS READING SOMETHING EARLIER TODAY WITH VINCENT CHEN, THE YOUNG CHINESE AMERICAN MAN WHO'D BEEN MURDERED IN DETROIT IN 1983.

SO THAT'S BEFORE THE '84 CAMPAIGN, BUT HE WAS STARTING TO DEVELOP RELATIONSHIPS WITH WHAT BECAME HIS RAINBOW COALITION.

HE WAS ONE OF THE FIRST PEOPLE TO REALLY EMBRACE THE LGBT COMMUNITY, SO PEOPLE FROM ACROSS THE SPECTRUM WERE THERE.

>> THAT WAS INTERESTING BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, HE GREW UP IN A PENTECOSTAL GROUND AND HE CAME FROM A RELIGIOUSLY CONSERVATIVE BACKGROUND.

I MEAN, HIS OWN SORT OF ORIGIN STORY, HE WAS, YOU KNOW, BORN OUT OF WEDLOCK, AND HIS MOTHER BEING SORT OF FORCED TO KIND OF HOLD HIM --FORCED TO STAND IN FRONT OF HER CHURCH CONGRESS GATION AND ASK FOR FORGIVENESS SO FOR HIM TO THEN EMBRACE REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS, TO EMBRACE LGBTQ RIGHTS FOR EXAMPLE, THAT WAS NOT, YOU KNOW, ORGANIC --THAT'S NOT SOMETHING HE GREW UP WITH.

>> SO I REMEMBER BEING IN HIGH SCHOOL IN INDIANAPOLIS AND GOING WITH MY PARENTS TO AN OPERATION BREADBASKET RALLY, AND IT WAS THE FIRST TIME I'D HEARD THAT.

"I AM SOMEBODY" CHANT, AND HE WAS RESPONDING AND SPEAKING TO EVERY SINGLE THING.

I MAY BE POOR, BUT I AM SOMEBODY.

THAT --NOW WE THINK OF THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT HAPPENED, BUT THAT WAS REVOLUTIONARY AT THE TIME.

IT WAS STILL JIM CROW AMERICA NO MATTER WHERE YOU WERE.

THERE WERE STILL THOUSANDS OF AFRICAN AMERICANS WHO WERE DISENFRANCHISED.

THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY WAS STILL CONTROLLED BY THE DIXIECRATS AND FOR SOMEBODY TO HAVE THE KIND OF PERSONAL ARC, THE PERSONAL EVOLUTION THAT HE HAD FROM SOMEONE WHO WAS BORN OUT OF WEDLOCK WHO WAS, YOU KNOW, TOLD THAT HE SHOULD BE ASHAMED, TO DIG DEEP DOWN INSIDE OF HIMSELF AND SAY, I IDENTIFY WITH YOU IF YOU'RE DISENFRANCHISED.

I IDENTIFY WITH YOU IF THE REST OF SOCIETY HATES YOU, AND I'M GOING TO TELL YOU THAT YOU ARE SOMEBODY.

>> KAREN TOMOLTIE WROTE SOMETHING DESCRIBING BEING ON ONE OF THOSE CAMPAIGNS AND JUST - -SHE'S WHITE, AND TALK ABOUT JUST THE UNBRIDLED RACISM THAT SHE SOMETIMES SAW DIRECTED AT HIM, AND SO I JUST WONDERED IF YOU AS A JOURNALIST, DID YOU EVER WITNESS SCENES LIKE THAT?

>> WE CERTAINLY KNEW THAT IT WAS GOING ON, AND I WOULD SAY EVEN FOR THOSE OF US WHO WERE WORKING FOR MAJOR NEWS ORGANIZATIONS, YOU KNEW THAT THERE WAS A SKEPTICISM ABOUT JESSE JACKSON'S CAMPAIGN, AND IN SOME WAYS, THE REPORTERS WHO WERE ASSIGNED TO THE CAMPAIGN, A LOT OF AFRICAN AMERICANS COVERED A PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN FOR THE FIRST TIME.

I KNOW I CERTAINLY COVERED SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME, AND IT WAS SO MUCH A PART WHEN I WAS --I WAS AT NBC, BUT AT ABC, CBS, "NEW YORK TIMES," "WALL STREET JOURNAL," "WASHINGTON POST," THOSE SLOTS, THE BOYS ON THE BUS WERE LITERALLY THE BOYS ON THE BUS, AND THERE WERE VERY FEW AFRICAN AMERICANS WHO HAD COVERED POLITICAL CAMPAIGNS, BUT THOSE POLITICAL CAMPAIGNS WERE, YOU KNOW, WHAT YOU USED TO SAY YOU GOT YOUR TICKET PUNCHED.

IT WAS THE THING THAT HELPED YOU MOVE TO THE NEXT LEVEL.

SO WHILE I CAN'T TELL YOU ABOUT A SITUATION WHERE SOMEONE WHO WAS A WHITE RACIST POURED THEIR HEART OUT TO ME WITH THEIR HONESTY.

I CAN TELL YOU ABOUT WHAT IT WAS LIKE TO BE A REPORTER AND TO KNOW THAT PART OF THE REASON THAT BLACK REPORTERS AND PRODUCERS WERE ASSIGNED TO THESE CAMPAIGNS IS THAT SOME OF OUR NEWS ORGANIZATIONS DIDN'T REALLY TAKE IT SERIOUSLY, AND THEY THOUGHT MAYBE WE MIGHT HAVE SOME SPECIFIC INROADS OR THEY COULD JUST GIVE US THAT ASSIGNMENT AND SOMEBODY ELSE WOULD GET THE BIGGER, MORE IMPORTANT ASSIGNMENT, BUT SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN'T LOOK AWAY FROM, AND SO WE HAVE TO COVER IT.

HE WAS STARTING TO GET A LOT OF ATTENTION IN IOWA AND NEW HAMPSHIRE.

SO HE COULDN'T BE IGNORED.

AFTER HE HAD HELPED GET THE RELEASE OF OODMAN, THAT MEANT THERE WAS NATIONAL ATTENTION TO WHAT HE WAS DOING.

>> ROBERT GOODMAN, A NAVY FLIER WHO WAS CAPTURED BEHIND LINES.

HE'D BEEN ON A RECONNAISSANCE MISSION AND HIS PLANE WENT DOWN IN ABOUT AREA THAT WAS HOSTILE TO THE UNITED STATES AND JESSE JACKSON WENT AND NEGOTIATED HIS RELEASE, WHICH HE WENT ON TO DO A NUMBER OF TIMES AND SO AFTER THAT, DO YOU THINK IT KIND OF CHANGED THINGS A LITTLE BIT?

>> YES, IT DID MAKE A BIG DIFFERENCE BECAUSE NOW YOU COULDN'T IGNORE HIM.

HE HAD ACTUALLY HAD AN ACHIEVEMENT, A DIPLOMATIC ACHIEVEMENT THAT THE U. S. GOVERNMENT HAD NOT BEEN ABLE TO DO ON ITS OWN.

SO YOU COULDN'T IGNORE HIM.

>> AND HIS SHOWING WAS MORE THAN PEOPLE THOUGHT IT WOULD BE.

WHAT WAS HE GOOD AT?

I KNOW PEOPLE HAVE BEEN PLAYING CLIPS OF HIS SPEECHES, THAT FAMOUS "I AM SOMEBODY" CHANT, HE APPEARED ON "SESAME STREET" WHICH IS KIND OF A PINNACLE OF MAINSTREAM ACCEPTANCE.

>> I AM.

>> I AM.

>> SOMEBODY.

>> SOMEBODY.

>> CERTAINLY HE WAS A GIFTED SPEAKER, BUT WHAT ELSE WAS HE GOOD AT?

LIKE, WHY DO YOU THINK HIS CAMPAIGN ACHIEVED WHAT IT DID?

>> WELL, HE WAS A GIFTED SPEAKER.

HE WAS VERY CHARISMATIC, BUT -- AND SOMETIMES PEOPLE MIGHT HAVE MADE SORT OF LIGHT OF THE RHYMING THAT HE DID, BUT THAT RHYMING AND THEN THE REAL ANALYSIS THAT HE WOULD MAKE OF WHATEVER THE POLITICAL SITUATION WAS, HE COULD BOIL IT DOWN IN WAYS THAT EVERYBODY COULD UNDERSTAND.

SO HE COULD HAVE THESE SORT OF BIG, POLITICAL THOUGHTS, THESE BIG POLICY THOUGHTS, BUT HE BROUGHT IT HOME IN A WAY THAT RESONATED WITH PEOPLE.

THAT MADE A HUGE DIFFERENCE, BUT I THINK HE ALSO HAD FROM HIS OWN EXPERIENCE, THAT AUTHENTICITY OF, I HAVE BEEN THE ONE WHO WAS DOWN AND OUT.

>> MM-HMM.

>> AND I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU A REASON TO BELIEVE THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO STAY THERE.

PEOPLE UNDERSTOOD THAT.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS NOTEWORTHY IS THAT A LOT OF POLITICAL ACTIVISTS WORKED ON HIS CAMPAIGN AND GOT ORGANIZING EXPERIENCE, THAT THEY LATER TRANSLATED INTO THEIR OWN CAMPAIGNS.

CAN YOU SORT OF TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT JUST THE POLITICAL IMPACT THAT HE HAD?

KIND OF BEYOND HIS OWN RACE.

>> WELL, SO I WOULD SAY THERE WERE MANY PEOPLE WHO WERE - -ERNIE GREEN, ONE OF THE LITTLE ROCK NINE WHO WAS ALWAYS AROUND, AND AS ONE OF ADVISERS, BUT I WOULD SAY ESPECIALLY WOMEN.

DONNA BRAZILE WHO REALLY BECAME THE FIRST BLACK WOMAN TO LEAD A --TO BE A CAMPAIGN MANAGER FOR A MAJOR PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN, THE GORE CAMPAIGN, THE ALBERT GORE CAMPAIGN.

SO SHE SAYS HE TAUGHT HER EVERYTHING.

SHE WAS STILL A YOUNG PERSON AND HE GAVE HER CONFIDENCE THAT SHE COULD ORGANIZE WHEN SHE WENT ONTO AN INCREDIBLE CAREER IN POLITICS.

MIGNON MOORE WHO WAS THE CHAIR OF THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION IN 2024.

THESE ARE WOMEN WHO HE BROUGHT TO THE TABLE.

HE SAID, I BELIEVE IN YOU.

I TRUST YOU, AND THOSE OPLE WERE ABLE TO LEVERAGE THAT INTO POLITICAL INFLUENCE LATER ON.

HE REALLY DID GIVE A LOT OF PEOPLE OPPORTUNITIES.

>> SOME OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE MAY KNOW ABOUT HIM THOUGH ARE SOME OF THE LOWER POINTS.

>> RIGHT.

>> LIKE THE EPISODE WHERE HE USED --I THINK HE THOUGHT IT WAS A PRIVATE CONVERSATION.

HE USED AN ANTI-SEMITIC EPITHET TO DESCRIBE JEWISH PEOPLE, BUT TALK ABOUT THAT, LIKE, IT JUST --IT'S HARD FOR PEOPLE TO SQUARE THAT PERSON WITH THE PERSON WHO WAS WORKING SO HARD TO CREATE KIND OF A MULTIRACIAL COALITION IN A WAY THAT REALLY HAD NOT BEEN ACHIEVED SORT OF POLITICALLY.

>> YOU KNOW, THAT --THAT INCIDENT HAS MANY, YOU KNOW, MANY ITERATIONS AND IT'S A LITTLE MURKY ON EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED.

I WAS NOT IN THE ROOM.

SO I -- I CAN'T SAY EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED, BUT IT DID, YOU KNOW, THIS USE OF A SLUR REALLY DID DO TREMENDOUS DAMAGE TO HIS CAMPAIGN.

I THINK HE -- HE ALREADY HAD SOME SKEPTICISM FROM SOME JEWISH LEADERS EVEN BEFORE THIS HAPPENED AND THAT JUST REALLY THREW THE CAMPAIGN INTO A TAIL SPIN.

>> MM-HMM.

>> I THINK OVER TIME HE FINALLY SAID, LOOK.

I DID THIS.

I'M SORRY THAT I DID THIS.

I DIDN'T MEAN IT IN THIS WAY, THAT SOMETIMES HE WAS TOO CASUAL WITH PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, SOME OF IT WAS THE --HE WAS A GUY WHO WAS BORN IN 1941 WHO GREW UP IN THE SEGREGATED SOUTH WHO SOMETIMES USED SLANG TO DESCRIBE PEOPLE.

>> COLLOQUIALISMS ARE SLANG, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU SPENT TIME WITH HIM IN SMALL CARS AND CARAVANS, AND BUSES AND BEING TIRED TOGETHER.

SO HOW DO YOU SQUARE THE PERSON WHO SAID THAT IN PRIVATE WITH A PERSON WHO WAS WORKING SO HARD IN PUBLIC TO DO THE OPPOSITE?

>> YOU KNOW, REVEREND JACKSON, YOU KNOW, LIKE ALL OF US, WAS A REALLY COMPLICATED PERSON.

THERE ARE FLAWS.

THERE ARE THINGS THAT PEOPLE HAVE CRITICIZED AND THINGS IN HIS PERSONAL LIFE.

THERE ARE FLAWS, AND HE HAD THEM, CERTAINLY.

I THINK WHEN I LOOK AT THE OVERALL ASSESSMENT, I HAVE TO SAY YES, THERE WERE THINGS THAT HE DID THAT, YOU KNOW, MADE OTHER PEOPLE --MADE PEOPLE UNCOMFORTABLE, THINGS THAT WERE NOT PARTICULARLY FLATTERING TO HIM, BUT WHEN YOU ASSESSED THE WHOLE PERSON, HE IS SOMEONE WHO OPENED DOORS FOR OTHER PEOPLE.

HE'S SOMEONE WHO GAVE PEOPLE CONFIDENCE.

HE CHANGED THE WAY THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY COUNTED DELEGATES.

THAT OPENED THE DOOR FOR BARACK OBAMA.

SO YES.

ON --ON BALANCE, HE'S A PERSON WHO WAS A VISIONARY WHO MADE A HUGE DIFFERENCE, BUT HE DEFINITELY HAD FLAWS.

YOU CAN'T IGNORE THAT WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT --AT THE WHOLE MAN.

>> INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, PRESIDENT TRUMP ACTUALLY RELEASED A STATEMENT PRAISING JESSE JACKSON AS A FORCE OF NATURE.

HE NOTED THAT HE PROVIDED OFFICE SPACE TO THE RAINBOW COALITION, WORKED WITH REVEREND JACKSON CRIMINAL JUSTICE REFORM, WHICH IS TRUE, THE LONG-TERM HBCU FUNDING, AND THAT WAS IN HIS FIRST TERM AND AILES LSO ASSERTED THAT HE PAVED THE WAY FOR OBAMA'S ELECTION.

CAN YOU SAY MORE ABOUT HOW HE PAVED THE WAY FOR OBAMA'S ELECTION?

>> WE HAVE TO MENTION RON BROWN HERE.

RON BROWN WAS THE CHAIR OF THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE, AND WAS VERY MUCH AN ALLY OF REVEREND JACKSON'S, AND AT THAT POINT PRIMARIES WERE WINNER TAKE ALL, AND IT WAS REALLY THROUGH THAT, YOU KNOW, SORT OF BACKROOM POLICY CHANGE THAT PRIMARIES BECAME PROPORTIONAL.

YOUR DELEGATES BECAME PROPORTIONAL TO THE NUMBER OF VOTES YOU HAD GOTTEN IN THE PRIMARY.

THAT WAS A HUGE CHANGE BECAUSE IT MEANT THAT IF YOU HAD ONE CANDIDATE WHO, YOU KNOW, WON BY 51% OF THE VOTE.

THAT PERSON WOULD HAVE GOTTEN ALL THE DELEGATES.

TO BE ABLE TO DIVIDE THAT UP, OPENED THE DOOR BOTH FOR REVEREND JACKSON TO GET A CERTAIN NUMBER OF PRIMARY WINS, BUT IT CERTAINLY OPENED THE DOOR FOR BARACK OBAMA WHEN HE WAS FIRST RUNNING, AND THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE DIFFERENCE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN WHETHER BARACK OBAMA WOULD HAVE BEEN THE NOMINEE OR HILLARY CLINTON WOULD HAVE BEEN THE NOMINEE, I THINK THAT POLICY CHANGE MADE THAT DIFFERENCE.

>> WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HIM AS A CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIVIST AND OF COURSE, WE'VE KIND OF MOVED PAST THE FACT THAT HE WAS ACTUALLY WITH REVEREND MARTIN LUTHER KING JR.

WHEN HE WAS KILLED.

I MEAN, HE WAS THERE IN MEMPHIS AT THAT MOTEL.

HE WAS ONE OF THE LAST PEOPLE TO SEE HIM ALIVE, BUT SO FAST FORWARD.

HOW DO YOU POSITION JESSE JACKSON AS SORT OF A FIGURE IN THE AMERICAN STORY?

WHAT WOULD YOU SAY IF YOU WERE WRITING HIS BIOGRAPHY?

>> THAT HE IS A PERSON WHO WAS BORN IN THE SEGREGATED JIM CROW SOUTH WHERE BLACK PEOPLE HAD FEW RIGHTS.

YOU WERE A LABORER.

YOU WERE NOT EVEN HAVING THE RIGHT TO VOTE IN MOST INSTANCES.

HE ALSO WAS A PERSON WHO, BECAUSE HE WAS BORN OUT OF WEDLOCK, WAS SUPPOSED TO FEEL SHAME, AND HE TOOK THAT --THOSE PERSONAL EXPERIENCES.

HE EXPANDED THEM TO LOOK AT WAYS TO INVOLVE AND TO ENGAGE AFRICAN AMERICANS AND OTHER PEOPLE WHO WERE DISENFRANCHISED, TO CREATE THIS COALITION, AND YOU COULD SEE THAT --BORN IN 1941.

THAT MEANS BEFORE WORLD WAR II, THAT HE THEN WENT THROUGH THE JIM CROW SOUTH, THROUGH THE OPENING OF CIVIL RIGHTS LEGISLATION.

HE WAS ABLE TO TAP INTO THAT TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THAT, TO BE A PART OF WHAT REVEREND MARTIN LUTHER KING WAS EMBODYING, AND THEN TO SAY WE ARE GOING TO HAVE A POSITION ON THE AMERICAN STAGE.

WE'RE GOING TO BE INTRICATELY INVOLVED IN POLITICS.

WE'RE GOING TO BE INTRICATELY INVOLVED IN CORPORATE AMERICA, AND WE WANT TO HAVE OUR PLACE AND OUR SHARE.

IT WAS A COALITION.

IT WAS DIVERSIFYING.

IT WAS DIVERSITY AND INCLUSION AND EQUALITY.

THOSE ARE THINGS THAT HE EMBODIED, AND EVEN THOUGH WE ARE SEEING A PUSHBACK ON THAT, I THINK THAT PEOPLE ARE GOING TO THINK OF HIM AS A VISIONARY AND WHILE SOME PEOPLE ARE SAYING, IS THIS THE END OF AN ERA?

I THINK IT IS A REMINDER THAT AS WE WILL SEE WITH WHAT THE FUNERAL SERVICES, THE MEMORIAL SERVICES, WE WILL SEE SOME OF THESE NEW, YOUNG PEOPLE WHO ARE INSPIRED BY WHAT HE REPRESENTED, TAKING THAT MANTLE.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR TALKING WITH US.

>> THANK YOU.